"The board agreed to put a 6-foot fence around a cul-de-sac on Blue Teal Lane. The fence is being erected because children in the area are walking and taking mopeds through the cul-de-sac and onto nearby private property, said Barbara Wilson, a board member and city councilwoman." Does this mean that because kids cut through my yard to get to where they want to be, that the city will come put up a fence around my yard!? It is becoming ridiculous what this council keeps approving. Explain to me the need for a sidewalk all the way down Charlestown-NA Pike- that leads to nothing!!!, but not one down a dangerous road that students must walk to get to school, one that leads to stores, banks, etc.

All:

Here is some information on at least some of the projects that have been mentioned in this thread …

Salem-Noble Road
I can see that there has already been some follow-up discussion on this topic, but I wanted to provide additional information.

This road is still property of Clark County. Road improvements are part of the KIPDA Transportation Improvement Plan (Project No. 539). The current Transportation Improvement Plan discusses program funding through Fiscal Year 2011. According to the plan, this project would widen Salem-Noble Road from Ind. 62 to Ind. 403. For Fiscal Year 2008, $300,000 in federal dollars have been programmed (it appears that this money is for right-of-way acquisition), however there is no reference to program funding for FYs 2009-2011. There is, however, a reference to future federal funding of $3.5 million for construction, which I assume refers to federal dollars that will be sought after FY 2011. In short, this remains as county project.

I believe there is an important point of clarification that is needed, relative to part of this discussion. Even if Salem-Noble Road was city property, it would be problematic to connect the lack of progress to work on Veterans Parkway. The Veterans Parkway work is being funded with tax increment finance dollars, which can only be spent on improvements within the TIF district. Therefore, such funding would not be applicable to work on Salem-Noble Road.

Allison Lane sidewalks
The primary portion of this project will take place on the west, or Jeffersonville High School side, of Allison Lane and would run from the intersection between Kmart and Meijer to Middle Road. A sidewalk is also proposed on the east side of Allison Lane from Beech Grove Court to Seminole Drive. Josh Hillman, of Jacobi, Toombs & Lanz, told me that design work is complete and that Greater Clark County Schools has donated the right-of-way in front of Jeffersonville High School. Before the project can be bid, funding – roughly $350,000 to $400,000 – must be committed. This morning I spoke with both Barbara Wilson and Ed Zastawny, regarding the funding. Ed said he believes most members of the council understand the importance of the sidewalks and that the work toward funding the project is ongoing. Barbara, an advocate for the sidewalks for several years, indicated to me that she wants the funding in place as quickly as possible so that the work can proceed.

10th and Spring properties
I don’t have much information on this, other than that the city sold its interests in properties at the northeast and northwest corners 10th and Spring in 2007. The city is willing to work with any developer who has an interest in a project on either corner, but because the land is now privately-owned it could come to pass that the city’s only involvement with a development on either corner is limited to things such as planning and zoning reviews or building and sewer permits.

Railroad crossings
As I have noted before, U.S. Code prohibits local and state governments from interfering with active railroad crossings. These crossings remain the responsibility of railroads that own them, regardless of whether they fall inside or outside a city’s corporate limits.

Larry Thomas
Communications Director
City of Jeffersonville

Thanks for the follow-up, Larry. Good information. A couple of follow-up questions:

Salem-Noble:
OK, so I understand the project is a county project. I also understand the "For Fiscal Year 2008, $300,000 in federal dollars have been programmed". Who gets those "programmed" dollars? Mike Mooore - do you know? Does it go directly to the County? Does it HAVE to be used for right-of-way acquisition, or can it be used to improve the intersection at 62 instead?

10th and Spring properties:
The City sold our interest in those properties? To whom? And when? And for how much? Maybe I missed that article, but the talk was always how the city WANTED that property so they could help dicatate what kind of businesses were placed there. Is that not the case anymore?

Railroad Crossings:
Is the City doing anything to prod the rail companies who own particularly bad crossings to do anything? Is there an office or organization who oversees rail crossings that the city can appeal to for help?

Hamburg/C-town Jeff Pike Intersection
Any word on that one? The city has been promising relief there for quite some time. That is a blind hill, and you have to look way back over your shoulder when turning left onto Hamburg. That there aren't more serious injury accidents there is amazing!

Spring Street Renovations:
Last word seemed to indicate that there was some issue with waiting on the power company or something to complete that renovation. Is that still the case?

Thanks!!

Mike

quote:

Originally posted by Supermike:
Thanks for the follow-up, Larry. Good information. A couple of follow-up questions:

Salem-Noble:
OK, so I understand the project is a county project. I also understand the "For Fiscal Year 2008, $300,000 in federal dollars have been programmed". Who gets those "programmed" dollars? Mike Mooore - do you know? Does it go directly to the County? Does it HAVE to be used for right-of-way acquisition, or can it be used to improve the intersection at 62 instead?

10th and Spring properties:
The City sold our interest in those properties? To whom? And when? And for how much? Maybe I missed that article, but the talk was always how the city WANTED that property so they could help dicatate what kind of businesses were placed there. Is that not the case anymore?

Railroad Crossings:
Is the City doing anything to prod the rail companies who own particularly bad crossings to do anything? Is there an office or organization who oversees rail crossings that the city can appeal to for help?

Hamburg/C-town Jeff Pike Intersection
Any word on that one? The city has been promising relief there for quite some time. That is a blind hill, and you have to look way back over your shoulder when turning left onto Hamburg. That there aren't more serious injury accidents there is amazing!

Spring Street Renovations:
Last word seemed to indicate that there was some issue with waiting on the power company or something to complete that renovation. Is that still the case?

Thanks!!

Mike

I had read something a while back that the city approved for a starbucks to go on the corner of 10th and spring street. This might be the private owner of some of the property. Just guessing

Mike,

I don't know the answer to your question.

I heard that Wes Johnson purchased the property. Is that true Ed Z?

Supermike:

I'll respond as best I can to your follow-ups ...

10th and Spring properties
Honestly, I didn't have much time to check into this during the day today. All I was able to find out was that the property was sold -- probably late last year -- and I didn't have time to get much more information than that. I really don't know why (nor did I have time to check in to whom) the properties were sold, meaning I really have no insight as to whether the sale will prove to be a good thing.

Railroad crossings
I touched on this a few months ago, but will revisit it. Railroads control railroad crossings, per U.S. Code. Local officials can beg, plead, yell, scream, etc., etc. but unless the railroad is inclined to fix its crossing, the crossing does not get fixed.

I believe part of the misunderstanding relating to railroad crossings stems from a reference Mayor Waiz made when he vetoed the annexation ordinance. One of the reasons he gave was that the fiscal plan included no money for the repair of railroad crossings. With all other reasons for the veto aside, this specific point was moot.

Another potential point for misunderstanding regarding railroad crossings is that there was a crossing improvement project in Jeffersonville two or three years ago in which the city was involved. But what largely precipitated those crossing improvements is that ACL/Jeffboat (the railroad's customer) wanted them, which helped grease the wheel, so to speak.

Hamburg Pike
The reconstruction of Hamburg Pike from Dutch Lane to Charlestown-New Albany Pike is in KIPDA's Transportation Improvement Program (Project No. 4). According to the TIP documents available on KIPDA's Web site, $2.87 million in federal funding is programmed for construction in FY 2008 and $730,000 is programmed for construction in FY 2009. The work includes the reconstruction of the intersection you mentioned.

Spring Street
Due to the expense (relative to available funding) of relocating some Duke Energy equipment, the streetscaping was changed to include the 100 block of East Court Avenue, running in front of Warder Park.

I believe the city's intention is to consider the streetscaping on Spring Street north to at least 10th Street, but do not know the time frame.

During the City Council meeting on Monday, there was a reminder that there needs to be a discussion of funding priorities in terms of what might be eligible for a Community Development Block Grant. My guess is that additional streetscaping along Spring Street might be part of that discussion, but may or may not be the ultimate project that is proposed for grant funding.

Larry Thomas
Communications Director
City of Jeffersonville

quote:

10th and Spring properties:
The City sold our interest in those properties? To whom? And when? And for how much? Maybe I missed that article, but the talk was always how the city WANTED that property so they could help dicatate what kind of businesses were placed there. Is that not the case anymore?

Larry, so good to see you earning your $36,000 salary. Sorry you had to give up your office in the "Executive Suite" to Jim Urban (the "$72,000 Man") and move to the windowless third floor office. So, what is the REAL STORY Larry? Who owns the property at 10th and Spring? Did Wes Johnson and/or his group purchase the property? Who owns the property at 10th and Spring?

Again, thanks Larry. I understand you were facing time constraints on your response. I appreciate you following up on it and not just ignoring my questions. Perhaps you can let us know on Monday to whom the city sold that property, and for how much.

I wouldn't bank on a Starbucks, fellow educator... they're CLOSING 600 stores, not opening new ones.

Does anyone on this site know how to follow up on KIPDA funding to see if it has been released? KIPDA means squat if they don't actually release the money. Based on the info Larry has provided from the KIPDA web site, the City should have $2.87M in federal funding for Hamburg Pike. If they have not received it, they should within the next few months.

Larry, I have to say "I was afraid of that" with regard to your response on the Spring Street renovations. I would like to see the Evening News do an official follow-up on this, though, because I don't ever recall that being brought out that the money was going to be reallocated to streetscaping Court. Not that the updates on Court don't look nice, but we've now left a chunk of Spring Street looking like crud, comparatively. The idea was that Spring would be a nice "entry" into downtown between 10th and Court. But I suspected with Waiz out, the job wouldn't get completed. If Councilman #2 is around, I'd like to know if he intends to discuss the Spring St. renovations in the upcoming meeting.

I also DO understand the constraints and confusion surrounding the railroad tracks. However, I find it extremely unfortunate that when Jeffboat cries, the city gets involved and helps lobby for updates. But when citizens cry out, the response is generally "sorry, it's the railroad". Why doesn't the city help us? That crossing on C-town pike is horrible. It seems to be mainly the CSX tracks that are bad. The crossing near Utica S-burg Rd was fixed, but one of the signs remains half gone and visibility is bad. That one needs flashing lights, as does the one at Salem-Noble and 62.

OK. About the Salem-Noble Road dispute with Councilman #2. As i read the law, he is wrong about the city's obligation to maintain it after annexation. Here's the code:

IC 36-4-3-2.5
"Public highway" defined
Sec. 2.5. (a) As used in this section, "public highway" has the
meaning set forth in IC 9-25-2-4.
(b) An annexation of territory under this chapter after June 30,
1996, that includes land contiguous to a public highway must also
include contiguous areas of:
(1) the public highway; and
(2) rights-of-way of the public highway.
As added by P.L.232-1996, SEC.1.

Problem is that code 9-25-2-4 doesn't exist anymore so you have to look at 8-2.1-17-14
which states:

IC 8-2.1-17-14
"Public highway"
Sec. 14. "Public highway" means a street, alley, road, highway, or thoroughfare in Indiana used by the traveling public.
As added by P.L.99-1989, SEC.8.

So, the city IS responsible for any areas of Salem-Noble Road where the boundary of the annexed territory touches (is contiguous with) the road.

Very interesting! Thanks for sharing that information. Perhaps Ed will share his take on that with us. SOMEONE is responsible for it, but no-one wants to TAKE responsibility for it. The City wants to blame the county or state, the county and state say "no, it's the City's", and in the end, only the people suffer.

I looked up where I had read about a Starbucks being built on Spring and 10th. Here is the link, read paragraph 12.

http://www.news-tribune.net/archivesearch/local_story_151120955.html

Not sure where you are looking but IC 9-25-2-4 is still in the '07-'08 law book. Same definition only it goes on to add privately owned business parking lots and drives that are open to use by the public.

From: http://www.newsandtribune.com/local/local_story_213121726.html

quote:

The board approved the construction of sidewalks on Allison Lane. The sidewalks will be constructed between Eighth Street and Meijer on the southwest side of the street and between Seminole Drive and Beechwood Road on the other side.

The project — which would construct 1,920 feet of sidewalk along with curb and gutter work — will cost approximately $395,000, said Bob Miller, city engineer and board member.

The board only approved the work; it will be up to the City Council to fund the project, he said.

I'm glad to see this, though I am curious why they are not running sidwalks all the way up to Thornton's. I guess they figure people walking there can cut across the parking lot?

Also, a question for Mike Moore:
Mike, do you know who put in the nice 200ft (+/-) turning/deceleration lane on 62 up near the solid waste district office? It basically appears to be a turn for an abandoned or delayed project of some sort, as the field that it turns in to is now all overgrown. It sure would be nice to have a turning lane like that at Salem-Noble!!

Also, with regard to turning lanes, whose responsibility would it be for turning lanes for River Ridge? The City's? River Ridge's? I noticed that NONE of the entrances to River Ridge have turning lanes, which seems a bit dangerous given the speed of traffic and the increasing amount of truck traffic on that stretch. The intersection of 62 and Salem-Noble, for example, is a regular turning spot for "Mister 'P'" trucking, and now they are building ANOTHER big warehouse there...

Perhaps Larry Thomas or the Evening News can look into this? I kind of feel like that area is being ignored. If it's about a new business locating there, then Jeff leaders stand up and shout "look what we're doing!", but if it's about turning lanes or fixing that dangerous intersection. According to info I've found, the minimum deceleration/turning lane for 55 mph traffic should be 225 feet. The turn to Salem-Noble is more like 75 feet!

According to the INDOT:

quote:

For driveway approaches to residential subdivisions, industrial parks, commercial
shopping malls, and similar developments where dedication as a public road
right-of-way is to be made, the design should conform to American Association of State
Highway and Transportation Officials' (AASHTO) "A Policy on Geometric Design of
Highways and Streets” (more commonly known as the Green Book). INDOT standard
sheets 610 for public road approaches should also be reviewed for design requirement
applicability.

See page 44 of this document:
http://www.in.gov/indot/files/driveway.pdf

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Supermike,

From page 45 of the above reference doc:

quote:

A Left turn lane shall be constructed to a driveway approach that will allow the turning
vehicles to decelerate and to enter the approach safely and without creating
unnecessary congestion to highway through traffic. A left turn will be required when
one or more of the following criteria is met:

a) On rural or urban divided highways where median width is equal to or greater than 7.3 m (24 feet), regardless of traffic volume.
b) Where an approach is constructed opposite an existing T-intersection making it a 4-legged intersection (required for both approaches).
c) Where a capacity analysis determines a left turn lane is necessary to meet the level-of-service criteria.
d) Where the accident experience, existing traffic operations, sight distance restrictions (e.g., intersection beyond a crest vertical curve), or engineering judgment indicates a significant conflict related to right turning vehicles.

It's not unusual to see 3-4 cars trying to turn left onto Salem-Noble at any given time, or to have semis waiting to turn into or out of RR.